Okay, yeah, perfect. Thank you very much for the time and for the insights here.
So yeah, I mean, I guess some of you were already familiar with the strategy and so on.
But now that we know what it has been done, then I guess you guys have some questions,
comments, and just to keep it like a custom practice now, I would like to kick it off
with a question, actually. And I mean, since I read the strategy, I was kind of like struggling
with this whole thing of inner-source. So I really wonder if you, now that the strategy
is almost over and then you're kind of like renew it. If you think this is the direction
to go, or like, you know, first of all, what do you guys mean with inner-source to put everybody
on the same page? And also if this is actually the direction that the commission should be
going or if you're thinking about something else.
Sorry, forget the very important microphone. Inner-source is really maybe not the best label
for this thing. But the goal was to make our software development, the commission has like
6,000 software developers working for it at any given time, doing all kinds of projects.
And some of them were in the room. And what we wanted to achieve is that on the road to
making the whole thing as open-source as possible, we needed the first step. We needed to have
the existing projects of which there are many realized that they needed to get ready for
reuse. And you can't go to a project that's been running for 15 years or for five years
and say, oh yeah, by the way, we're going to make your stuff available next year. Because
these guys are like, whoa, but it's full of passwords. It's full of internal references
to machines and stuff. So the code has to be matured. And so we've gone through bug bounties
and hackathons internally to make sure that projects were ready to move from being, you
know, in the basement with just these five people that have been working on this for
10 years to being shared with the other colleagues, with the other professionals whom we can rely
on not to abuse the information that is often in these systems. And the other thing that
we're doing is that we're only, we're making it easy for projects to go open source as easy
as we can. But we're not forcing them. If there are reasons within the team, within the DG,
within the service to say, this is so niche, why should it be open source? Or this is so
secretive, why should it go open source? We're not going to force them. But we already see
a lot of projects going open source because most of the developers, this is where they
want them to go. And they'll talk to their project managers to say, we should go from
inside, we should go to Code.org Europa. So the numbers that were on the slides are very
good and give us another decade. Maybe that's too slow. It might go faster.
All right. Yeah. No.
Hi there. My name is Romer Adams. I'm working at Red Hat. Building actually a solution for
the public sector. Two quick comments. First of all, great that you discovered that there's
our responsibilities with CRD, SCRA and PLD from a code perspective. So it's good. The
second part is that in a source for taking this into consideration is one of the best
thing you can do when you are in a very disconnected environment and you cannot share anything
with outside from a security perspective because you can apply all the construct of open source
to build software. And at some point when you clean everything up, you can share that
with the other member states. The last part is more a question there. When we're thinking
about the open source catalog that you have built, I guess we're speaking also about blueprints.
Will there be any incentive for member states to get to those blueprints as a first class
citizen in tenders versus trying to build something from scratch?
Hot potato.
Thank you.
Good question. So I think the idea of reuse is warmly welcomed by almost everyone. Why
would you build something twice if it's already working in municipality A? Unless it's not
good enough. You could amend it, you could improve it and that's the idea of an open
source solution. Alluding to your question about making it mandatory or incentivizing,
it's not for the commission to do that. I think open source is by its very nature a
very cooperative, open culture. So we are hoping that procurement will come on board
and say, why do you want to build this? Show me that this doesn't already exist in the
European catalog. So I think it'll happen eventually because it just makes financial
sense. So I think that's where the solutions will become blueprints.
Hi, my name is Dali Boran. I work for the commission services. So I'm a user, but I
didn't work there for all my life. So I also worked as a developer in the industry in the
education and coming back after several years, I saw a great progress in open source software
on my computer. So thank you for that. On the other hand, as a practical user, I have
problems with it because I've seen things moving in another direction. We are forced
now to use the Office 365, as you know, then TMS teams for also internal and external communication,
not to speak about the applications for some jobs which you can fill in the form only using
Microsoft Windows or some testing for in Epsoc, which can also be done on Microsoft Windows
computers. So I cannot do anything about it. I mean, I've been trying using the available
open source software as much as possible, a LibreOffice, and even some other solutions.
But I think you might. So I urge you, at least if not to look for some long term or radical
solutions, which I would, at least not to allow this regression of the current situation,
which I see coming in six months to one year. Well, depends. I mean, internally, what do
you use for your team communication? Please answer that question.
You need the microphone as well.
We use everything, including the tools that come with the machine and when we switch it
on. But we also use all the alternatives. And if you were a software developer for the
commission, well, if you were, then the good news is you can have a Linux laptop at your
disposal and running Ubuntu mostly. And this, yeah, we're, you know, we see that pain point,
but I can already tell you that the OSPO is not there to make that switch. What we can
do is translate the demand from our users, which includes you to say, look, there is
a need for an alternative. And there's many teams that interact with the outside world
that cannot use MS teams. There are many teams and projects of people working on legislation,
in fact, they're asking us, do you have anything because I cannot use Office 3, whatever? It
won't work. And so with them, we're trying to figure out what's the next thing we put
in our lab and how can we make it accessible to legislators in the member states so that
they can work on the next generation of laws. So we're trying to find ways to do this.
I wish we could show a lot of progress. I think it'll take a bit of time because, yeah, it's
in place.
Yeah. So I think the first thing to say is that we absolutely acknowledge what you're
saying. That's the truth. Right? Now, the question is how do we solve it? It's a collective
we as crisis outlined as the Ospo we are doing things like using some of the labs and some
of the other mechanisms, right? We're pushing open source. So there's another movement,
right? Open source is expanding throughout the commission and its awareness is benefits.
And yet there is an entrenched Microsoft culture. So I think we it'll just it's a question
of time and it's a question of continuing to pass on the messages that you're mentioning.
And we do that as the Ospo. So I think that's the answer. Sorry.
It has to change. I agree. The best moment to start that change is now and we're trying
to bring those experiments.
Exactly. We're doing something what we can.
I'm sorry. I would say let's go for a question and then maybe you can.
So well, thank you. But unfortunately, regression is going the other direction. And unfortunately,
it consumes more work time. It consumes more money, bandwidth, energy, so it's not compatible
with Green Deal. And also, please think about this. If we would have, you know, an open source
working environment for all the administration in Europe and for the politicians, maybe they
would think differently and then support the open source more.
Okay. I agree. And then I take command from that again.
No, no. I always say it's a question here.
Okay.
Yeah. My name's Ingen and I'm just a citizen. I was trying. I'm trying to put this question
somewhere. I'm not sure whether it fits. But why we were busy with CRA, another regulation
sailed by which has implemented, which implicates maybe problem for open source, which is the
European ID. So A does. And how can we assure that this European ID will work on open source systems
of all kinds? So on free smart, free androids on Sailfish, on Linux smartphones, on Linux
desktops and everywhere. And how can we ensure that the ID application itself is open source,
which I think is mandatory for a fundamental thing like this?
That's not about.
You want to leave the room now? No.
I can get part of the answer. And I'm going to look in a few other things, if you don't mind.
Because there's so much going on. And as I was trying to say, there are good developments
happening in Europe. And I want to first acknowledge there's a circle on this diagram, and I put it
back online. These are the OSPOs in the member states. And four of them are in the room. Five of them
a few minutes ago. And we're working with these peers to figure out, A, the citizen interaction.
I think that's a, it's clear that we need to, this is a goal for us, a task for us that we didn't
identify three, five years ago. And about the commission is doing a lot of open source reference
implementations. So when we, when there is a big regulation like this, like A does, for example, there is an
open source reference implementation. I do not know if that one would immediately run on your mobile phone,
but it will run on a Linux machine. That's what it was made on. It was made for it. And this is also
how we help the member states test their implementations because they can either use the reference
implementation and install that, or they can test theirs against our reference implementation. And we do this
with many other tools. So you'd be surprised to find commission, commissioned, sorry for the strange
formulation there, but software built for the commission, either by software developers working directly
for the commission or through companies that are in industry everywhere. If you do an import, export
decoration these days, you're touching software that is made available as open source and built through the
European commission. If you're in the steel industry, you're most likely doing things that is done with
open source commissioned by the commission. If you're doing e signatures, it's most likely using open source
libraries that were developed as open source through the commission. So this is one of the good things that is
happening. And then I would just like to point out that the OSPOS are doing good stuff in the member states too,
and we're trying to build a network that reinforces itself.
So let's take two more questions because we're running out of time.
Can we get the OSPOS to stand up just so we know who they are?
Thank you for the great talk. And we spoke a lot about infrastructure and tools, which are very important.
But is there a European wide plan to somehow replace Mastercard and Visa? These are essentially payment clearing systems,
and these are leaking hundreds of billions of euros worth of economic value out of the thing. If there could be an open
source trustworthy solution built into it, which every bank issues to retail people, that would be great.
Wonderful.
I think that's the answer. We're not the right people. And these are very large initiatives. There are many, many
large things that could be done. We are working at the grassroots level in terms of open source, propagation of open
source internally and connecting with OSPOS externally, and doing projects like FOSCEPS.
And check out the NGI funding framework because there are super interesting projects on this topic too.
Okay, so one last question.
Thank you.
Hi, Paolo Vecchi, board member of the Document Foundation. Well, I would like to say thank you guys,
or the OSPOS team, or the European Commission, which is now 150 people. I think most of it is in this room.
And, well, a handful of it, because I actually seen the progression of what has been going on in, well, lately, and you did a very good job.
In a way, you said that, I think you commented that probably is not your job yet, maybe, also to promote some open source platform within,
maybe the European Commission, or just part of the way the users will see mostly.
So we have an example of LibreOffice, or maybe also Linus Texop, or something like that.
I suppose that that probably is going to become one of your tasks later on, maybe when you're going to be more structured.
But in a way, I hope that we're going to get to a point where the European Commission actually is going to be the example for the rest of Europe,
where an organization that manages enough people to fill a small town will show how to do things, how to implement open source,
so that for a small town to nations, actually going to be able to do it quite easily.
And another thing regarding, well, something that I'm very biased about, LibreOffice, there's been a bit of an effort,
a lot of effort in trying to get LibreOffice updated in the Catalog application, the European Commission.
It is there, at least, so in theory, it should be able to install that quite easily.
And it would be nice to have more feedback and see how many other open source applications you would like to see on your desktop,
so that the rest of the community can say, there guys at the European Commission, can you please add this one,
because it actually makes sense and we help other people switch into open source.
That is a collective effort. Thanks.
Okay, perfect. So any comments on there? Should we wrap up?
Yeah, we can wrap up.
Okay.
I'd just like to tell you that LibreOffice is on the Commission's laptop, so...
Yeah, I think the general answer is the small army that can fill a town is already using open source, right?
That's why open source is on our list of software to use, officially.
So it's a lot more usage than we... that might be visible, right?
But sometimes the external tools like teams and things and word...
We have to connect with everybody in the Commission, right? So it's increasing. Thank you.
Okay, perfect. I'm sorry, we need the microphone.
Okay, so now we're going to have a wrap up from the repertoire on the inside's inputs that we got.
Thank you very much, everybody. But let's take around five minutes.
Only five minutes and then you can go.